The State of Digital Music: The Rdio Conversations

This page was pasted in on 4/2/2012

31 minutes ago
dms .
@Nohbdy – thanks for posting the link. Very interesting. I grabbed pretty much the same as you from that article. I know for me, I have noticed a cutting back on purchased downloads since subscribing to a streaming service – Spotify prior to being here on Rdio. I think what will suffer the most is going to be physical CD’s. Really, the only way to get anyone to buy CD’s is focus on the packaging and whatever extra’s they can stuff in a box. Not sure if you’ve noticed, but I have – it seems like every release now has a “Deluxe” version w/video content or a limited edition whatever… stuff you can’t get from a download or a stream. 5 years ago – only anniversary releases were given such prominence. It kind of cheapens the collectors items these days… could be the reason why vinyl seems to be making a comeback.

3 hours ago
Nohbdy
I didn’t see that article as a comparison between the two (because yeah apples and oranges).
I thought the main point, or at least the one I took from it, was that downloads and subscriptions are both up, despite the criticism that as subscriptions increase they will detract from downloads and physical purchases. The article even hints that as subscription has increased purchases have grown even more. (this is conjecture on my part since the article just puts info out there and doesn’t draw any conclusions)

4 hours ago
Lacey Underall
Yeah, I saw that. I don’t think you can compare streaming with downloading. Apples and oranges. Or radio station revenue vs album sales. Completely different revenue generating methods. Completely different customer base.

A lot of people only buy 5-10 albums a year. It really doesn’t make sense for them to join a subscription service. Especially since there are cloud services now for the more technologically advanced. On the other hand, rdio will never get more than $10 a month from me and I used to spend $50-$60 a month on CD’s.

Streaming is still in the “early adapter” stage. From a technology standpoint, it requires more constant internet access (I had to explain to someone you could cache songs now). But it also requires you to think about music and what it means to “own” something.

The proper measure for success of subscription services is probably more the number of users or the number of tracks streamed and not the revenue generated through subscriptions.

What is good is that *both* forms of LEGAL music ownership are growing.

4 hours ago
Nohbdy
More food for thought:
http://digitalmusicnews.com/permalink/2012/120328download#bWWmUKEdpwOWuz-MC8ql6g

4 hours ago
Jason Paul
Interesting thing about artists not getting paid for streaming. Seems more on the big label scale than the small I’d guess. The artist doesn’t really even need the label to distribute digitally. It’s just a bit of paperwork. But I guess without that there’s no incentive for a big label to promote.

5 hours ago
Jason Paul
I’m wrong about the Pinterest thing. It’s just buggy. I clicked the Pinit browser button a few times and Pinning came back…so let’s blame Chrome for this and not Rdio!

6 hours ago
maudeman
Probably inane copyright IP issues. re album art and pinterest.

4 hours ago
Nohbdy
Sean Parker’s SXSW comments:
“So there’s blood in the water. There’s a war coming, and they’re going to have to deal with it.” (RE: Labels and Artists)
http://digitalmusicnews.com/permalink/2012/120315parker
(has nothing to do with the previous pinterest comment)

6 hours ago
Jason Paul
Why did Rdio block Pinterest? Pinning album art can only be a good thing. Now album pins are without context.

7 hours ago
Jason Paul
And I miss Recommendations, for those times the queue runs out. Anybody see this. Looks like artists ARE starting to see income from digital music: http://paidcontent.org/article/419-digital-music-now-pays-artists-more-than-pub…

4 days ago
Jason Paul
I’m used to the new Rdio interface…although I think actual socializing is way down for me…but listening is slightly up

1 week ago
Mark Ingraham
Bloodshot Records – appears that most of the catalog is finally available again! Hint: If you’re looking for JC brooks, they have two copies listed – the first one is unavailable, an available one is quite a ways down their page.
Here’s the link to the label: http://www.rdio.com/label/Bloodshot_Records/

1 week ago
Kyle Peacock
The only thing I’ve ever really used the desktop app for is building my Rdio collection from my iTunes collection.

3 weeks ago
Jason Paul
kind of a duh moment for me. Only just now checked out new Rdio in Chrome to realize it’s now exactly just like the desktop app…so what’s the point of the desktop app?

3 weeks ago
Mark Ingraham
Thanks CAW – just caught that. A tad bit annoying that I now have to delete what I had that now shows as unavailable and reload it with the “new label”

3 weeks ago
Bunqo
The weird thing about the removal of album art from playlists is that it doesn’t even free up much screen real estate. I can see 23 tracks at a time in my browser using the new view vs. 17 with the old view. And most of the album titles get cut off now.

3 weeks ago
Jason Paul
I hope (as I suspect many of you do) that they bring back the album art in playlists. I would guess that not having it may have something to do with improving speed.

3 weeks ago
CAW a.k.a. The Aquatic Ape
Not so, Mark. They seem just to have migrated: http://www.rdio.com/label/World_Music_Network/

3 weeks ago
Mark Ingraham
Just noticed that all of the Rough Guide compilations are no longer available – bummer 🙁
http://www.rdio.com/label/Rough_Guides/World_Music_Network/

3 weeks ago
gretchen
(noting the unfortunate photo of the *old* UI…)

3 weeks ago
Jason Paul
Benign response to Rdio’s new app announcement at SXSW—more about the uphill battle streaming music still has http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2012/03/13/BU461NK3UE.DTL

3 weeks ago
Jason Paul
And another thought…why can’t the iPad app be exactly like New Radio?? I would never need to use my computer for music again.

3 weeks ago
Jason Paul
New Rdio is scary. I’m sooo glad they’ve kept the reviews. It reminds me of a less ugly version of Spotify

3 weeks ago
One Mighty Mike
IMHO- The good of the new interface- looks cool, very itune-y like. However, nothing beats the CHROME EXTENTION for playlist management with the old interface. Thoughts?

3 weeks ago
Joseph Thornton
Introducing: New Rdio – http://blog.rdio.com/us/2012/03/introducing-new-rdio.html

3 weeks ago
Jason Paul
I love Paul Goode’s mashup suggestion. Imagine if artists actually could get something for that kind of reappropriation of their work in addition to passive consumption royalties.

3 weeks ago
Paul Goode
What if Rdio became a platform for listening to Audiobooks, found sound and Smithsonian-esque audio archives? What if Rdio merged with Soundcloud?

4 weeks ago
One Mighty Mike
I don’t know— my first thought was rdio buying out MOG…but really why would that make our subscription any better? Unless they incorporate some of MOG’s interface which has some neat features not currently on rdio. Then I started thinking…maybe they are gong to make the service FREE..at least for a period of time? The business guy in me thinks not. The ability to “shuffle” my ipad collection and playlists on roku (which happened today) would have been big news to me in itself… which leads me to believe this is going to be something REALLY BIG.

4 weeks ago
Paul Goode
Rdio subscription:
– also gives you Amazon Prime
– extends to streaming music videos and documentaries
– allows a number of downloads per month, like E-Music
– allows you to set up a radio station, complete with live audio breaks and multiple DJs

@Ryan – I like the exclusive catalog access idea.

They’re giving us access to the catalogs, but they’re not letting us mashup music or play with album covers… or more creatively use Rdio to communicate. Seems like an area of opportunity. These digital services are going to have to change how we think about collecting and interacting with music.

4 weeks ago
Ryan Kelley
I’m really anticipating the announcement. I’m hoping for:

-Apps integration similar to Spotify’s (LyricWiki, Pitchfork, SharemyPlaylists, etc.)
-Loading local library into the apps to fill the holes Rdio’s catalog may have.
-Some huge band exclusive…? (Metallica, The Beatles, etc.)
-Full catalog upgrade to 320kbs
-New desktop apps that aren’t dependant on flash software.
-Site redesign? (I would hope not a huge change)

There was actually something else I thought of… I just can’t recall it.

4 weeks ago
Jason Paul
Sounds exciting…some guesses…maybe way off:
-Deep Apple integration like Apple did with Twitter (probably not)
-iOS Apps that are as feature rich and social as the desktop app (this is just what I want)
-Better Facebook Integration (if I see a friend listen to a track I can add it to my queue from Facebook without having to listen right away)…this is probably too small

shite, i’m out of guessess…i actually can’t think of anything else right now

4 weeks ago
One Mighty Mike
Any thoughts or speculation what the big announcement will be from #rdio on March 13th? I can’t STAND the suspense.
http://goo.gl/NCRMi

5 weeks ago
Michael Jandron
@David and @OMM, I misspoke and hence the reason I deleted the post. When I thought I was “Subscribing” to playlists I was instead “Adding to Collection.” So, I was wrong. The extension works fine. I was just an idiot and assumed the “Subscribe” button was top on the list as it usually is!

So – the extension works fine. Sorry for the confusion.

5 weeks ago
David Crompton
@OMM what subscribe/collection business is that? Until what gets worked out?

5 weeks ago
Jason Paul
That’s a little discouraging regarding MOG. I’d gather it’s doing about as well as Rdio. There’s a mystery to the economics of this music streaming. I hope it’s not too good to be true.

5 weeks ago
Brian Goddard
CNET: Mog for sale.

http://news.cnet.com/8301-31001_3-57386736-261/struggling-music-service-mog-for…

5 weeks ago
One Mighty Mike
@Michael below thanks for the heads up about the subscribe/collection business with the chrome extension. I will pass until that gets worked out because that would be a nightmare for me! It would make me think twice about subscribing to playlists (like the Billboard Dance one of mine that you subscribed to) that update frequently…or those with many tracks! I am basically an “album only” collection guy…. I use playlists for individual songs. That would make the chrome extension…dead on arrival for me regardless of other great features it might have.

6 weeks ago
David Crompton
@Ron Yeah there’s a crazy lag on it! At the moment it seems to be carrying my listens from last night indivually on foot from San Fran to London…

6 weeks ago
David Crompton
Couldn’t anything other than ‘setting up interface’ or something like that from LetsListen but this Anthm thing looks cool, Tod. Thanks for throwing these down…

6 weeks ago
Ron Bronson
Thanks for the Rdio app. Anyone else noticing that scrobbling isn’t going to last.fm via rdio lately? Or is that just me? Or is it a significant lag?

6 weeks ago
tod nelson
And here’s a IOS mobile app for Rdio users that sounds interesting:

http://techcrunch.com/2012/02/20/bad-taste-in-music-crowdsource-your-next-party…

6 weeks ago
David Crompton
@Grace nothing in terms of functionality—but they’re functioning in two more countries so that’s a change!
@Tod–checkin…
@Joseph has there been hinting about new features?

6 weeks ago
tod nelson
Has anyone checked out LetsListen.com? Here’s an article about it on Techcrunch:

LetsListen: Turntable.FM + Video Chat = Dance Party?

6 weeks ago
grace martin
anybody notice any changes after last nights “down” time?

6 weeks ago
Michael Jandron
Wow, that chrome extension is really nice! Can’t wait to use it!

6 weeks ago
Joseph Thornton
@Nohbdy Oh my! Thanks for the Chrome link! Wow!!!!

@mrshl I too hope that Sunday’s maintenance will add new features that they’ve kinda been hinting about like “New commenting” etc 😀

6 weeks ago
David Crompton
Anyone beta testing the new Last.fm scrobbler?
Mac: http://cdn.last.fm/client/Mac/Last.fm-2.1.14.zip
Windows: http://cdn.last.fm/client/Win/Last.fm-2.1.14.exe

6 weeks ago
mrshl
Haha. I use the extension already, but I think they should make native features that do the same thing (and maybe more).

Further thought: even if you could only star a song (and not a record), it would be cool if it had the option to “love” the track on Last.fm simultaneously.

6 weeks ago
Matt L
Man its hard to beat the synth in this song!

🙂

6 weeks ago
gretchen
@mrshl — note the way Lala had a star system in that printscreen? I don’t know why Rdio couldn’t do the same — the layouts for album pages are pretty similar already.

6 weeks ago
David Crompton
@BC — like ‘2 days until the end’ kind of thing?

the horror.

6 weeks ago
gretchen
No DC, Lala had a “we’re closing” banner — for the entire month before they shut down. It was hard to see that every day, and so seeing something similar in appearance (but not meaning) on Rdio still causes a bit of a gut reaction.
http://tinyurl.com/byebyelala

@gee, couldn’t say for sure. My assumption is Rdio could not have started offering free streaming so quickly (in response to Spotify) and NOT pay the rights owners without renegotiating every agreement.

6 weeks ago
David Crompton
I’m prepared to be happily surprised [new features] but my initial expectation from this maintenance was that it was backend scaling related to Rdio now operating in five countries [surely with plans for more.]
The maintenance banner certainly doesn’t represent a harbinger of Rdios downfall to me–is that how Lala went down? I guess an acquisition is certainly possible though…

6 weeks ago
Biker Chick
heh.. I deleted mine also. 🙂

@DC – it just hung there as a constant reminder of the countdown.

6 weeks ago
Nohbdy
Edit: ok so since three of us said the same thing I will just delete and leave the link to the extension:
https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/hmaalfaappddkggilhahaebfhdmmmngf?utm_…

6 weeks ago
geemarcus
@mrshl: many of those features are available in Matt Harrison’s rdio enhancer extension for Chrome.

Faving/starring songs would be good a start. I’d like to be able to tag songs/albums/artists like you can at last.fm but I asked rdio for that and was told it wasn’t being planned.

6 weeks ago
mrshl
What about the future of Rdio. Anyone else hoping that Sunday’s “maintenance” will deliver a site with new features? What features would you like to see from Rdio?

I’d love to have the ability to fave / star songs and albums with a single click (a la spotify). Also:

-add album to playlist
-remove duplicates from playlists
– comment on or like user activity (make user engagement even easier)

6 weeks ago
Matt L
To Marcus’ first point, this may highlight a bigger issue. Adele doesn’t even think of Rdio as a concern. Even the author of this article didn’t bother checking or at least mentioning that Adele was available to free or paid customers here.

That seems like the biggest concern to me. And I get tired of hearing myself say, “Where is Rdio’s PR?!?!”

6 weeks ago
geemarcus
@Gretchen: Are you sure that’s how it works? The reason I ask is that if you joined Columbia or BMG CD club back in the day I recall that the one cent CDs you got didn’t generate any income to the label.

6 weeks ago
geemarcus
rdio still has fremium service, right? So why does Adele let it stream here? Did I miss something?

6 weeks ago
gretchen
If the license owners get paid regardless, what do they care if Spotify (or any streaming service) allows some listeners to stream it for free? In other words, the music isn’t being given away for free, it’s the streaming service (and whatever margin of profit the provider gets) being giving away.

On the flip side, perhaps offering only “premium” content to paying customers — in addition to unlimited — might be another model. But I don’t see where it affects artists getting paid at all. (It think the proper distribution of royalties, once they are paid, is a much more problem-ridden area, and has been for a long time.)

6 weeks ago
unhillbilly
Interesting .. maybe this is an opening for Rdio http://www.fastcompany.com/1816582/why-spotify-turned-down-streaming-adele-21?p…

7 weeks ago
Brian Goddard
Search multiple streaming services (Rdio, MOG, Spotify, Soundcloud, etc) all at once:
http://www.mattmontag.com/smasher/
Works nicely and seems pretty well up to date.

7 weeks ago
Jason Paul
Most Musicians Don’t Make Money Off Streaming Services, Study Shows. http://www.prefixmag.com/news/most-musicians-dont-make-money-off-streaming-serv…

Rebuttal please. Let’s rebut!

2 months ago
David Crompton
Spotify looking for a UI designer…. http://www.coroflot.com/public/job_details.asp?job_id=37931&all;=y&refe…

2 months ago
Todd Dominey
Re: Spotify’s growth. One word: Facebook.

2 months ago
David Crompton
8,000 subs day. wow. http://www.fastcompany.com/1811680/spotify-growing-by-8000-subscribers-per-day-…

2 months ago
PDH Loves Wine, Women & Song
Verdy interestink: http://kurtcagle.tumblr.com/post/16412105304/was-megauploads-death-a-hit-job

2 months ago
Jason Paul
Would be nice if Facebook added service specific tools to music in the feed. Like ‘Play Later’ for my Rdio queue.

2 months ago
Jason Paul
Did you guys see this, Facebook’s next step on Frictionless sharing and Pandora backing away? http://www.cnn.com/2012/01/18/tech/social-media/facebook-pandora/index.html?hpt…

3 months ago
Jason Paul
Totes y’all. I think catalogs will always be in flux. I’m actually toying with starting a record label and digital reach is the most important to me (cause Rdio is hard to hit if you’re not a big player…Spotify is easy..go figure). So if I learn anything interesting as I send tracks out for distribution I’ll report that info here!

3 months ago
gretchen
JP, I think the press has generally missed that story from the beginning. Comparing catalogs is a waste of time, when they’re all so similar. The free accounts cover the gaps, regardless of which service you pay for. So don’t base the choice on catalog, base it on the user experience that works best for you.

@mm I remember the overhauls at Lala eventually caused many traders to quit altogether. on the flip side, they seemed to be able to drive new members to the site in discernible waves (unless they were creating bogus accounts — always wondered about some of those that showed up nearly at the same time in the New Member section) — I think there were targeted promotions happening pretty frequently in magazines or other sites.

3 months ago
Matt L
There are definitely things that need fixing. Would I love to be able to play my entire collection on shuffle through iOS? Yes! Would I love if they spent a little more time paying attention to how they add bands so there aren’t mixups like 4 or so bands listed under the name Rome
http://www.rdio.com/#/artist/Rome/
I actually had them fix this awhile back, but it reset back to the way it was shortly afterwards.

But I would gladly ignore all of that if I felt like they were doing everything possible to drive new subscribers to their service. I’m just not there.

3 months ago
Jason Paul
Another Spotify vs Rdio in Wired: http://www.wired.com/epicenter/2012/01/spotify-vs-rdio-part-2/?utm_source=faceb…

I think they’re missing the story. It’s about User Experience…their catalogs are very similar

3 months ago
unhillbilly
With regard to new features, or the lack thereof, I suspect contributors to this conversation are far more demanding than the majority of the potential audience Rdio needs to capture to be sustainable. Were I running the show, I too would be spending all effort getting traffic to a break-even point. It appears the Rdio catalog has sufficient mass-market appeal – see http://www.wired.com/epicenter/2012/01/spotify-vs-rdio-part-2/ .

3 months ago
maudeman
Unfortunately, It seems the development side is on a pretty lean budget, too, and as important as marketing is, the site hasn’t improved much since its early days, outside of the catalog.

3 months ago
David Crompton
@Matt—Agreed. As time passes it really seems as though it’s not a matter of marketing kicking in full blast at some point [as I believed for a long time] but rather Rdio operating it’s marketing efforts in a pretty lean fashion [as a strategy.] That’s how it *seems* anyway. I really hope this doesn’t cost them [and us] in the long run.

3 months ago
gretchen
oops, haven’t tried it yet.

3 months ago
David Crompton
Exactly, Gretchen! Hey is that FB thing working for you guys yet? I have the play button but it doesn’t do anything.

3 months ago
gretchen
FIXED: PR tinkertoy

3 months ago
Matt L
I remember when my little brother actually signed me up for Rdio figuring (correctly) that I was too lazy and would never do it myself. My major issue was that I would spend all this time reviewing, compiling lists, finding new artists; only to lose it all when eventually the doors were shuttered on the service.

Its actually more of a concern now that I actually use the service and I see how inadequately Rdio promotes themselves.

3 months ago
David Crompton
Which really is another big move which also demonstrates, once again, the invisibilty of Rdios marketing/PR machine↴

3 months ago
David Crompton
Rdio now live in Germany!

3 months ago
tod nelson
Can’t wait!

3 months ago
gretchen
looks like fun Tod! let’s try it!

3 months ago
tod nelson
Looks like Facebook will be rolling out a turntable.fm-like feature for Rdio. Already works for Spotify.

Facebook Launches “Listen With” For Turntable.fm-style Simultaneous Music and Chat

3 months ago
Jason Paul
digging that Music Smasher!

3 months ago
gretchen
Check this out too — search for music on Rdio, Spotify and Grooveshark simultaneously. And then click right through to play on your provider of choice.
http://www.mattmontag.com/smasher/

Now if someone would create an app that runs with this, letting me build integrated playlists or play my queues from several services in a single interface…whoa!

3 months ago
gretchen
Rob, I think they said MOG wasn’t included because MOG doesn’t have APIs to enable the same extract of its catalog.

Although the analysis says Rdio is superior, I think your point is the best one. Each service’s catalog is going to have holes, and depending on what kind of music you want to listen to most of the time, well, that’s probably where you’re going to go.

My suggestion is if social is a big factor, definitely have an Rdio account, and supplement it with whatever other service works best. All of them seem to offer a limited free subscription, so that seems really workable to me. Also, all of them let you mothball/reactivate your account even if you cancel paying. So that allows a lot of flexibility in reactivating/switching as things change over time (features added, features taken away, catalogs change).

3 months ago
skydivingrhino (rob)
At the risk of rousing maudeman’s ire, I’m disappointed they didn’t include MOG in this analysis. Ever since their UI and search overhaul, I find them to be a much better complement to rdio than Spotify. MOG has a very extensive catalogue, fills some of the same holes as Spotify (e.g., Funkadelic, Charles Lloyd’s ECM releases during the previous decade) and offers some albums neither of the other two do (e.g., Hüsker Dü’s SST releases, Peter Gabriel’s first three solo albums, the Sunnyside label)

3 months ago
gretchen
Thanks Mark.

I thought this analysis of the Rdio and Spotify catalogs was pretty interesting:
http://www.wired.com/epicenter/2011/12/spotify-vs-rdio/
I think it shows it’s workable to have a paying account on one of the two services, and use the other’s free service to backfill what’s missing. Like Swedish Death Metal, oh yeah, glad I’m covered there!

(Crossing my fingers about the possible Rdio reviews & comments changes Joe alluded to elsewhere won’t be driving me to Spotify…)

3 months ago
David Crompton
@Tod –Sued x4! I never dug that operation but I guess it sucks if they’re your team.

3 months ago
Mark Ingraham
For anyone concerned when(if) you noticed that most of Bloodshot’s catalog disappeared from Rdio, I found this on their twitter feed:

BSHQ Bloodshot Records
@jamespollard We’ll be back up in running on Rdio soon — just doing some housekeeping! Sorry about the inconvenience.

3 months ago
tod nelson
Grooveshark is getting sued:

Grooveshark sued by EMI Music

3 months ago
tod nelson
They came up with an app on Spotify to do what we all already do on Rdio. But it’s interactivity is pretty nifty.

http://top10.com/spotify

There’s a short article about it on Techcrunch:

http://techcrunch.com/2012/01/05/top10s-nifty-spotify-app-drives-100000-song-re…

3 months ago
Jason Paul
thought: I actually now know a handful of people subscribing to Rdio. Interestingly none of them have engaged in the social aspect. Some, I know, solely use Rdio through the iPhone app which has very poorly implemented social. If you can’t talk to people is it really social? This is a huge opportunity for engagement (and retention) for Rdio. It’s why no one wants to leave Facebook. It’s why it would be really hard for me to leave Rdio. Hopefully Rdio will invest more deeply in the social aspect of their iOS apps.

3 months ago
Jason Paul
Idea…I think Rdio could really gain some traction and differentiate itself if it encouraged users to embed the Rdio icon in their social profiles/vcards and what not. Instead of shying away from the fact that it’s a decent social platform for music…embrace it.

3 months ago
maudeman
Owning 30% of a company does not get you bupkas unless the company goes public. If the stock included a board seat, that would be some influence, but the record companies do not like and have not liked Spotify’s freemium model since day one, which is why it took them so long to get to the US.

I do think it will take an Apple (which makes more in a quarter than any other the major labels are worth) to change the dynamics.

4 months ago
Lacey Underall
I think the major labels owning a decent chunk of Spotify cuts both ways. It gives them an obvious leg up on getting licenses from the majors which is a huge obstacle to success as a subscription service.

But on the other hand, it kind of makes them beholden to the major labels as well. And I think the major labels have an incentive to run Spotify in a way that benefits them the most at expense of the users and the indies.

4 months ago
maudeman
@Rob Tod et al

Spotify seems to be the one current streaming company with the potential to get big enough to use their size to get better deal from the record companies – qand they do own a good share of th company. I still think both Apple and googe and maybe Amazon will find away to stream as well. Record company power is declining, but they still “own the songs”

4 months ago
gretchen
yeah, it’s rough.

On the flip side, I just tried the Chrome extension for adding albums to a playlist. That sucka is SLICK…completely seamless! Dare I say, godhead.

4 months ago
geemarcus
After signing my life away with auricle (all those permissions) all I can get is an error page.

edit: Worked on the fifth try.

4 months ago
Jason Paul
I thought this one was cool http://www.musicmaze.fm/
I stopped using it cause I guess I like being real deliberate with my music consumption

4 months ago
Jason Paul
yeah, that’s what I mean! but wow…at a glance I’m pretty confused by Auricle…

4 months ago
gretchen
You mean like this one plugs into Rdio?
http://auricle.fm/

4 months ago
Jason Paul
I think apps like Beatrobo could really work well if they just plugged into a streaming service for the media.

4 months ago
Rob Treynor
THanks Tod. I’m trying it out right now. Quirky, buggy, but has serious potential. Interesting that it uses YouTube for the source material

4 months ago
tod nelson
Anybody see this? I’m willing to give it a try….

Social Music Community Beatrobo Makes Sharing And Listening To Songs With Friends Easy, Asynchronous

4 months ago
Jason Paul
Facebook UX design has always been lacking. I think they just make it up as they go along.

4 months ago
gretchen
oh never mind. I should expect to get irritated by FB. I admit that place makes me feel alive.

++grace…but, if other sites start to offer a richer communal experience, I’m keeping the door open …to moving.

4 months ago
tod nelson
To turn on Timeline, go to:

http://www.facebook.com/about/timeline

and in the bottom right corner, click on “Get Timeline” and voila!

4 months ago
grace martin
i dont know about anybody else, but i would be happy to pay a lot more for my monthly subscribtion to rdio. i spend hours here, and would miss it TERRIBLY if it went away. compared to the price of a single movie, thats over in 2 hours, i must pay about 5 cents an hour for rdio! thats an amazing deal.

4 months ago
gretchen
Me neither. Do you have to flip a switch to turn it on somewhere? I saw tod’s, looks nice.

@wotf, that was Alec, one of Lala’s employees, who put that little utility together for us. Thanks unhillbilly for taking a look here.

4 months ago
Jason Paul
No timeline for me yet. I feel like I’m always the last one to get these rollouts.

4 months ago
David Crompton
@Tod I’ve set my Timeline up and I do really like the way it integrates music activities.

4 months ago
wifeonthefarm
@UH – hopefully Rdio will be around a while yet. Probably 3/4 of my collection is music I own and matched so it’s the 1/4 that I don’t own that I’d like to archive. Remember that guy on Lala who created the have and want list export files for us? You smart kids will hopefully figure something like that out for the rest of us.

4 months ago
unhillbilly
@Mark + @WOTF re: saving your stuff. The Rdio API exposes your collection http://developer.rdio.com/docs/read/rest/Methods#collection and playlists http://developer.rdio.com/docs/read/rest/Methods#playlists. It wouldn’t horribly difficult to extract that stuff, and even migrate it to Last.FM or Spotify. Not that I’m not expecting the imminent vaporization of Rdio .. but one never can tell. We might not be as fortunate as with Lala where there was time to scrape stuff before it was shut down. I’ll poke around a bit.

4 months ago
Jason Paul
@Mark it would be cool if Last FM could scrobble playlists. It seems like their strategy of being service agnostic could solve the playlist/collection problem if they can get Last.fm to integrate better to all these other services.

4 months ago
Mark Ingraham
@ wifeonthefarm – I agree that potentially loosing a collection that you’ve worked hard on is a huge bummer. I had asked via Rdio-help if there was a way to download the title/artists in our collections to an excel sheet and apparently there isn’t.
My solution to document my collection: go to your collection, list albums rather than the default artists, sort by artist, wait for the whole list to load, print to PDF. It makes for a long document since the album covers show up as thumbnails but at least I have some type of record of my collection.

4 months ago
Nohbdy
At the end of the comments of that article someone mentioned Senzari, so I went to check it out. Got an invite and looked around. Senzari is a giant step back in streaming music. It’s just internet radio. you can’t even like something or tell it if something it played is not right. added to this you still have the licensing that hampers pandora, you only get a couple of skips per hour. the only thing that it seemed to have that was redeeming is it uses FB chat so you can talk with your FB Friends (not much of a plus).

4 months ago
Rob Taylor
Heres an article disputing that last one:

http://tech.fortune.cnn.com/2011/12/14/spotify-will-never-turn-a-profit-not-so-…

4 months ago
tod nelson
Timeline on Facebook is available to all now. Has anyone checked it out? Music activities are integrated into it in a cool way–not so “stream” intrusive.

@Maudeman: that was a great but depressing article. I met with a music industry lawyer recently who told me much of the same. He highlighted that Rdio and Spotify had to pay millions of dollars to the labels just for the right to stream, and he highly doubted that any of that money gets into the artists hands. He also confirmed that the big labels are trading streaming rights for equity in the streaming companies–also money that artists will never see. He said that the big three labels own 30% of Spotify.

4 months ago
Jason Paul
I think Rdio may have better quality control with their selection than Spotify. Just because the distributers they partner with are real distributers. Spotify has deals with Tunecore and CDbaby which any shmuck can use to distribute their music (I can say this because I’ve done this). This is actually great for artists to be able to get it out there. But to Rdio’s credit I think it’s not a bad idea to vet for more serious stuff for those putting in extra effort. And perhaps it shows.

4 months ago
geemarcus
From the linked article:

“Unless you’re a huge fan of Norwegian death [sic] metal, it’s hard to see this as anything but a win for Rdio.”

See y’all later folks! (just kidding!) Actually the comment is pretty baseless. OK, Darkthrone’s classic albums are MIA from rdio; I’ll live.

4 months ago
Jason Paul
that was a bit depressing. I would love some better transparency as to what everyone actually makes off of music when it is streaming. I know we’ve seen hypothetical stats, but if a band or label were to show the actual numbers of who got what on a particular album for one year that would be revealing.

4 months ago
unhillbilly
Ok .. something upbeat: Dark Side of the Moon, Blonde on Blonde, London Calling, The Chronic .. ALL on Rdio but not on Spotify http://t.co/dUTEe74Q

*UPDATE* Also not on Spotify: http://rd.io/x/QE7SK4xa2g

4 months ago
wifeonthefarm
Maudeman, that WAS a depressing article. Looks like it’s only a matter of time before I lose yet another meticulously gathered streaming collection. I have purchased a lot of music as a direct result of discovering new-to-me artists via subscription streaming, even back in the Lala days where our dimes per track were basically our subscription cost. I am paying the music labels twice – what more do they want from us?

4 months ago
maudeman
Well, the record companies have been F’ed up for a long time, so it’s no big surprise. They make Apple and Google and Facebook seem like good citizens.

4 months ago
maudeman
Labels

http://tinyurl.com/c5so5t9

4 months ago
Brian Goddard
http://on.vh1.com/tmVEg1 Interview with the Black Keys on the decision to not allow El Camino to appear on popular streaming sites like Spotify, Rdio and MOG.

4 months ago
Jason Paul
@Turdish Burl … that’s a sad moral. Although I still don’t believe in buying mp3s (i’ve just cooled my rhetoric of late).

4 months ago
Turdish Burl
This morning (about a 36 hour turnaround) I finally received a polite but short response from support. They credited me back for the EP I couldn’t download, stated that “In general” downloads are 256KBs MP3s and then pointed me at a couple of FAQs.

@Nohbdy I was aware previously that downloads were not available to Canada but they also used to not show up as an option on the web app here either. So when I saw them for the first time Wednesday, I assumed the licensing issues has been sorted out. No such luck.

@Lacey Underall That’s pretty crap design. I wonder if there is a lack of communication or something between the web crew and the desktop devs. Also, I have never bought anything with iTunes so am not sure if is the same but not allowing people to re-download tracks they have paid for is ridiculous, especially considering we are talking about MP3s. It’s akin to only letting you read your email once before it self-destructs.

Guess the moral of the story is don’t buy music from rdio.com.

4 months ago
Nohbdy
I thought I saw some way to download if you couldn’t use the desktop app.
Oh, well that’s not the biggest issue. TB, If I recall correctly you’ve stated you are north of the border. According to there download FAQ Rdio can’t offer downloads in your region, due to licensing, so the fact you could purchase at all is the problem.
http://help.rdio.com/customer/portal/articles/59001-downloads

4 months ago
Lacey Underall
The way rdio handles purchases is pretty stupid. The fact that they don’t tell you you need the desktop client until you’ve already paid is only one of several flaws. You can actually count yourself kind of lucky you don’t have Windows.

Because if you DID have Windows, you would have downloaded the desktop app and your files still wouldn’t download. Then if you hit reload or try to re-download again through the website you’ll be charged again. The way to get those downloads is to go into the menu and do “file->check for downloaded music” which makes no sense because the music you want ISN’T downloaded.

And you can complain to Rdio and they will be very polite but you will not get a refund.

4 months ago
Lacey Underall
The way rdio handles purchases is pretty stupid. The fact that they don’t tell you you need the desktop client until you’ve already paid is only one of several flaws. You can actually count yourself kind of lucky you don’t have Windows.

Because if you DID have Windows, you would have downloaded the desktop app and your files still wouldn’t download. Then if you hit reload or try to re-download again through the website you’ll be charged again. The way to get those downloads is to go into the menu and do “file->check for downloaded music” which makes no sense because the music you want ISN’T downloaded.

And you can complain to Rdio and they will be very polite but you will not get a refund.

4 months ago
gretchen
@TB, contact your credit card company and have them mark the transaction as disputed.

4 months ago
Turdish Burl
Heads up if anyone else uses Linux for their OS – rdio.com ripped me off yesterday when I tried to purchase an EP. Didn’t tell me until after it took my money that you have to have the desktop app installed to actually download the music (which I can’t do since I don’t run Windows or MacOSX). No response from billing either after 24 hours. . .

4 months ago
maudeman
Spotify Exec (hypothetically) says Sony getting crushed by Samsung.

4 months ago
Jason Paul
The Black Keys are blocking their new album from streaming: http://pitchfork.com/news/44845-the-black-keys-block-new-album-el-camino-from-s… (I guess Coldplay had done this too)
I’m not a fan but hopefully they don’t cast themselves in the lamo Metallica role of the 00s (when they were anti-Napster). Perhaps Spotify (especially) may need to do some better outreach to artists to get them onboard with streaming. On some level I can’t blame them for opting out of streaming. But I think this will hurt more than help them. I think the dam has already broke.

4 months ago
Jason Paul
Sony Exec says Spotify could die like Myspace: http://www.prefixmag.com/news/sony-executive-says-spotify-might-die-like-myspac…
meh, can’t trust music industry execs to be forward thinking

4 months ago
Rob Taylor
I have enough buttons at the bottom of articles, reviews, etc. (facebook, twitter, google +, digg, etc.) I don’t want another one with Spotify everywhere. I don’t want a collection of “apps” on my computer. I want an internet. I’m with Lacey on this one.

I already resent the fact that Spotify, while having the absolute worst interface imo, is a hundred times more popular than Rdio or Mog just because Sean Parker is buddies with Mark Zuckerberg. Maybe that’s just the hipster part of me but still.

3 thoughts on “The State of Digital Music: The Rdio Conversations”

  1. Great post and comments!

    Right. So… Is Rdio the Future of Music?

    The problem with these sorts of “x is the future of y” discussions, particularly where technology is concerned, is that x always changes the nature of y. Because of this, you can never quite arrive at point y.

    I see Rdio and it’s ilk bumping into a few issues shortly that run along these lines:

    1) The closer these services get to delivering on the promise of offering “almost everything” in the world of music, the more they will underscore what isn’t offered. Put another way, how much music needs to be available to make up for the fact that what you want to hear right now isn’t?

    2) Part of the appeal of these services lies in the social aspect, which presently is built on the enthusiasm of early adopters and music nerds. The tone and quality of the social interaction will change as more users sign on. Will Rdio still be compelling?

    3) Rdio is presently a novel way of trying to monetize music in a time where monetizing music is difficult. It’s an experiment that is occurring concurrently with other experiments at trying to resuscitate the monetization of music. A verdict will be reached. Recent high profile releases by Coldplay, Black Keys, Tom Waits — to name a few — are not present on Rdio. Presumably this is because posting on streaming services is viewed as possibly undermining the success of other channels, both experimental and traditional. Is this the start of a verdict being reached? Will this assessment be shared by others?

    Just a few thoughts.

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